Comments on: Alternative Compensation Systems https://archives.lessig.org/?p=2816 2002-2015 Thu, 10 Apr 2008 23:12:34 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=5.7.2 By: kort https://archives.lessig.org/?p=2816#comment-7852 Thu, 10 Apr 2008 23:12:34 +0000 http://lessig.org/blog/2004/10/alternative_compensation_syste.html#comment-7852 This discussion is probably stale, but maybe someone can benefit from this late addition…

File sharing is only a problem because the release of recorded performances to the public domain has been delayed. Shortening the period of time required for creators to recover fair value for their recorded performances would allow music to be released to public domain sooner, eliminating the problem of piracy – and along with it all of the related costs and alleged need to infringe on the rights of citizens in the name of enforcing copyrights.

The last piece of the puzzle is a mechanism for artists to be fairly compensated for contributing their recorded performances to the public domain. Propagate Ltd (www.propagateltd.com) has developed a unique form of dutch auction designed to solve this last piece of the puzzle. A Propagate auction allows an artist to receive the fair value for a recorded performance as an up-front lump-sum in return for releasing certain of their rights to the public domain.

For a more complete exploration of this issue – including an historical perspective of how we got where we are today, and a way to achieve a workable solution – check out: http://www.kortexplores.com/node/174

]]>
By: John C. Morgan https://archives.lessig.org/?p=2816#comment-7851 Wed, 27 Feb 2008 12:41:23 +0000 http://lessig.org/blog/2004/10/alternative_compensation_syste.html#comment-7851 Several record companies have used my performances and picture for profit. I have not signed any contracts denying my access to performing royalties. How do I go about recouping my performer’s royalties? John C. Morgan

]]>
By: John Goodwin https://archives.lessig.org/?p=2816#comment-7850 Tue, 26 Oct 2004 22:01:36 +0000 http://lessig.org/blog/2004/10/alternative_compensation_syste.html#comment-7850 It seems to me that “Intellectual Property” as a discussion topic is doomed to recapitulate the entire history of economics.

Congratulations. You have reinvented “Social Credit” for intangible products.

]]>
By: Andrew Boysen https://archives.lessig.org/?p=2816#comment-7849 Tue, 26 Oct 2004 16:07:48 +0000 http://lessig.org/blog/2004/10/alternative_compensation_syste.html#comment-7849 No scale is needed at all to make this work. We don’t even need to start with a database, or anything like that. An artist, producer, or whatever can put up a link on their site that says, “Pay us $20 – or whatever – and you can do whatever you want with our music without paying any more and we won’t sue you.” Lawsuits are already the enforcement mechanism in place. Universities are paying for site licensing of music so they don’t get sued – this can happen on the individual level as well. People can keep doing what they’re doing right now, but for a small fee they can eliminate the risk. Media companies can do the same thing they’re doing now, except they’ll have to sue fewer people who are breaking the law.

Owners are getting compensation, and users can do what they do now while avoiding all risk. The downside is that this benefits the big owners who are most likely to sue, but it gets the ball rolling in the right direction, and the costs of implementing this is near 0.

]]>
By: Raoul https://archives.lessig.org/?p=2816#comment-7848 Tue, 26 Oct 2004 14:29:29 +0000 http://lessig.org/blog/2004/10/alternative_compensation_syste.html#comment-7848 What about a donation system? A mechanism that will allow users to easily compensate the artist directly for the work in any amount that the consumer sees fit?

We all tip our waitresses 15% to 25% after our meals. There is no governmental enforcement mechanism that makes us do that. We do it because of social enforcement mechanisms.

Furthermore, I was in and around numerous rock bands in the 80s. You should see some of the things fans are ready, willing and able to do for their entertainers. Fans desperately want to compensate the artists. They just are being denied the opportunity to do so, in an efficient manner, by the corporate greed heads who no longer serve any purpose.

]]>
By: ErikT https://archives.lessig.org/?p=2816#comment-7847 Tue, 26 Oct 2004 13:23:42 +0000 http://lessig.org/blog/2004/10/alternative_compensation_syste.html#comment-7847 These points might be discussed in the book. I have unfortunatly not had time to read it. However, I thought I would throw in a few comments despite my lack of research.

Has there been any financial analysis, I saw the reference to the descreased cost per household but I am looking for a more indepth discovery of the benefits and pitfalls.

As many have pointed out the devil is in the details. IMHO gaming the system will be a huge problem if complete anonymity is used. Some type of registration mechanism will have to be implemented. This will most likely require and incentive for users to register. If consumers are concerned that a single agency can�t be trusted to only use the results as an aggregated sample; then possibly a 3rd party should be created that works with the evaluation engine. A trusted 3rd party registration system could provide a buffer that allows tallying anonymously and provides the added ability to discover fraud. The transmission of information back to the evaluation system must be secure and meet certain security considerations including non-repudiation.

I don�t think you can conscientiously destroy the aggregated results at the end of each month. You must have an audit trail to provide support for prior decisions and to defend against musician/producer protests of each allotment. Another reason the information couldn�t be destroyed some people would contend this system would directly affect the financial viability of a corporation; therefore it would most likely need to conform to portions of Sarbanes-Oxley Act.

Even if this system was put into effect, I don�t think it would remove the need DRM or encryption. DRM is going to have to be used to help track copying, file renaming, and derivative works. The registration of a song will most likely have to be based on some form of DRM and a certificate authority.

Thanks for guest staring this week, it has been an incitful discussion thus far.

ErikT

]]>
By: Jardinero1 https://archives.lessig.org/?p=2816#comment-7846 Tue, 26 Oct 2004 13:13:09 +0000 http://lessig.org/blog/2004/10/alternative_compensation_syste.html#comment-7846 I enjoy these discussions, really I do. But, after a while, I realize again that this “problem” is nothing more than a property dispute between a handful of giant corporations peddling really shitty music and a cohort of mostly male adolescents and post-adolescents ripping them off. Why not let them fight it out? Why should we change society to insure that these youths pay these corporations?

Spare me the platitudes about art and the free exchange of ideas; that’s not really in danger(this blog and the whole internet is proof positive). What this boils down to is money for a very small group of players.

]]>
By: Brian Hunt https://archives.lessig.org/?p=2816#comment-7845 Tue, 26 Oct 2004 12:05:01 +0000 http://lessig.org/blog/2004/10/alternative_compensation_syste.html#comment-7845 1. There is no adequate way to estimate the ?value? of an artistic work.
There isn�t anyway.

Marketplaces assign value, by definition, as a function of supply and demand. Copyright, by being a monopoly, is subject to alternative pricing models, but still adheres to the laws.

The more downloads you get, the more money you get.

Downloads from where? By whom? Who pays? Who verifies? How much? When does the value change? How does it change? Who decides? What influences the decision maker? Can the consumer appeal changes? Can the consumer stop paying? Who is exempt? (Non profits? Elderly? Corporations?) Does that exemption create a loophole? It’s nice in principle, but when you have multi-billion dollar companies acting in their own interest against the system, simplicity goes out the window.

4. A taxation of any other industry effectively subsidizes artistic works at the expense of another marketplace. A high cost, with questionable benefit.

Broadband is driven by media use. If media production is harmed by broadband, both marketplaces will suffer. This is the world of the RIAA as well as ACSes.

I don’t think broadband being driven by media is a good excuse to intrinsically tie these two together. The value of broadband is not inherent in access to commercial media (eg. wikipedia, Lessig’s blog, etc.), and any such tying would be too strong a relationship, inherently harming both the broadband marketplace by making it more expensive without inherent value increase, and worse, with substantial harm to the incentives of the media industry to adapt to a new and superior internet based market model.

]]>
By: Rob Myers https://archives.lessig.org/?p=2816#comment-7844 Tue, 26 Oct 2004 11:44:55 +0000 http://lessig.org/blog/2004/10/alternative_compensation_syste.html#comment-7844 Governments are good at subsidizing or stabilizing economic bases such as electricity and water, not entertainment commodities such as music, movies or video games.

Governments subsidise movies with tax breaks for production, treaties for distribution, and with DMCA/INDUCE they’re throwing in free investigation and enforcement.

1. There is no adequate way to estimate the ?value? of an artistic work.

There isn’t anyway.

2. Wherein then do the incentives lie?

The more downloads you get, the more money you get.

3. […] Though the current marketplace isn?t easy to enter, the internet has created new ways to create and distribute that make the barrier to entry far less than it has previously been.

Since the marketplace would be all-internet, this holds.

4. A taxation of any other industry effectively subsidizes artistic works at the expense of another marketplace. A high cost, with questionable benefit.

Broadband is driven by media use. If media production is harmed by broadband, both marketplaces will suffer. This is the world of the RIAA as well as ACSes.

]]>
By: Sim, WooMin https://archives.lessig.org/?p=2816#comment-7843 Tue, 26 Oct 2004 11:16:36 +0000 http://lessig.org/blog/2004/10/alternative_compensation_syste.html#comment-7843 Thank you for your article. I read this post very interestingly. I live in S.Korea. Your idea is available in S.Korea, I think.

Nevertheless, I can’t understand your explanation about the first problem, ‘International Scale’. I think that your view in this problem can increase inequality between advanced countries and underdeveloped countries in the sense of economy.

Can you explain about this? Thank you for your reading.

p.s. I’m not good at English. I’m sorry about this.

]]>